ceo and founder of better allies for inclusive workspaces

Allyship is Crucial for Equity - A Conversation with Karen Catlin

After spending 25 years building software products and serving as a vice president of engineering at Macromedia and Adobe, Karen Catlin witnessed a sharp decline in the number of women working in tech. Frustrated but galvanized, she knew it was time to switch gears.

Today, Karen is a highly acclaimed author and speaker on creating more inclusive workplaces for women and others from underrepresented groups. She is the author of four books: "Better Allies: Everyday Actions to Create Inclusive, Engaging Workplaces," "Belonging in Healthcare," "The Better Allies Approach to Hiring," and "Present! A Techie's Guide to Public Speaking" (coauthored with Poornima Vijayashanker). She also emails a roundup of “5 Ally Actions” to over 30,000 newsletter subscribers every week


What do you think is important to measure when it comes to equity in the workplace? For example, if you could reimagine an organization’s KPI’s (key performance indicators - targets that help you measure progress against your most strategic objectives) to be centered around equity and culture, what would some of them be and why?

Many organizations start by measuring the demographics of their workforce (gender, race, age, and other aspects of identity). While this approach gives insight into diversity, it doesn't measure inclusion or equity. So, organizations utilize pulse surveys to gather engagement data by identity, understanding how likely employees are to recommend their company to others, how long employees see themselves working there, and other dimensions of engagement. These reports can give leaders insight into who feels included (or not). But, to measure equity, more needs to be done.

  • Are employees from underrepresented groups assigned the right job level for their years of experience?

  • Are they being paid equitably in terms of both base pay and stock/bonuses?

  • Are they experiencing the same career velocity as their majority peers?

  • Do they feel set up for success?

I recently spoke to a Latino software developer who attended a community college and then learned to code via boot camps and other training programs. When he got his first full-time tech job in Silicon Valley, he was elated by the role and the salary — $75K/year. After working for about 12 months, he decided to speak to his boss about a raise. Before doing so, he talked to a white man who started at about the same time as him, doing the same job. He asked if he also was thinking about a raise. The other man said, "Yes, I'm earning $120K, and I'd like to get more." After picking up my jaw from the floor, I said, "Please tell me your salary is at least $120K now." The Latino man told me, "Oh, it's much better. I'm now making $145K in a new role."

The right KPIs can expose holes in equity, not only regarding pay but also career advancement. Then, armed with the data, leaders can identify systemic changes so that they hire people at the right level, pay them the same as their peers, and set them up to thrive in their careers.

When it comes to equity in the workplace what do you feel people aren’t thinking about?

To create more equity, many organizations start with top-down initiatives, tasking HR or DEI leaders with their success. While that can be a valuable strategy to drive change, I firmly believe it should be coupled with a bottoms-up approach, where individuals feel a personal sense of responsibility to create a more inclusive culture. I want more people to take notice of how colleagues who are underrepresented experience the workplace and take steps to make it more inclusive. I want more people to be better allies for their coworkers. Yet, allyship is unfamiliar and uncomfortable territory for many of us. And this is why I do the work I do today.

After spending 25 years building software products, I'm now an advocate for inclusive workplaces. My goal is to break down any barriers holding us back from seeing inequity and taking action. In 2014, I embarked on this ambitious mission by starting a Twitter handle called @BetterAllies. I regularly share simple, everyday actions to create more inclusive and equitable workplaces, along with cautionary tales of discrimination and exclusion. Over the years, I amassed thousands of examples, which I've since curated into three books: "Better Allies," "The Better Allies Approach to Hiring," and "Belonging in Healthcare."

Recently, I was speaking about my work on Better Allies, and a man in the audience asked me how to best give feedback to someone who said something disparaging about another person or culture. Because he didn't know how to do this, he admitted he probably wouldn't say anything the next time it happened. I answered with my favorite technique: Seek common ground, then educate. For example, imagine you hear someone tell a Black person they were so articulate in the staff meeting. (It turns out that many Black people don't think this is a compliment because of the underlying assumption that they couldn't possibly be well-educated, well-spoken, or articulate. It's a lousy stereotype.) You can speak up by seeking common ground: "I used to think that calling someone articulate was a compliment." Then educate by moving on with, "But I have since learned many Black people don't think so …" Then summarize the underlying negative stereotyping. This approach is a powerful way to give someone feedback without shaming or blaming them.

"To address proximity bias, organizations should measure where people work and examine how this data relates to pay increases and promotions."

What do you think is changing in the workplace that organizations need to start proactively thinking about?

We're seeing a shift to hybrid work, where people work in the office some days and from home on other days. Of course, some hybrid teams also have fully remote employees. With these blended approaches, organizations need to look out for "proximity bias" — a tendency to favor people close to you.

An article in the Wall Street Journal provided this insight into how proximity bias can impact employees: "Sure, you can hit your performance targets from the kitchen table and wear out the 'raise hand' button on Zoom. But a colleague who chats up the boss when the meeting is over and goes for a drink after hours may get ahead."

To address proximity bias, organizations should measure where people work and examine how this data relates to pay increases and promotions. Over time, if those spending less time in the office (and on different days than managers) are behind their in-person peers, steps should be taken. In the short term, people who strive to be better allies should be aware of and look for proximity bias. Simply reminding themselves it can exist, especially during talent review cycles, may be enough to disrupt it.

Do you think it’s possible to change an established workplace culture? Why or why not?

While one bad apple can spoil a bunch, I believe the opposite can be true in workplaces: that one good ally can inspire others to act more inclusively. The behaviors we model can have a noticeable ripple effect and shift culture.

Here's one example from my book, "Better Allies." In April 2018, automation-in-testing advocate Richard Bradshaw discovered that the Code Europe conference he’d agreed to speak at had lined up only male speakers (a whopping 87 of them). He promptly canceled, explaining in a blog post:

"How did I let this happen? Your name was on that conference page Richard, your company was on that page! I felt embarrassed. These thoughts came after cancelling my attendance, cancelling was a must, as a male speaker who cares about their craft, cares about inclusion, there was only one option, the right one. It was great to read a few replies later from some of the other male speakers cancelling their attendance."

Simply seeing Bradshaw announce his cancellation prompted other men to follow suit.

Similarly, as David Smith and Brad Johnson wrote in their book, "Good Guys":

"Remember all those junior men around you. They’re always watching. When a male ally speaks up, he’s not only effecting change in the room at that moment, he’s inviting and empowering the next generation of men … And that is how we change a culture."

Creating a more inclusive culture isn't going to happen overnight. Instead, start with a single act of allyship. While it may seem small, you’ll make a difference. You may even start a ripple effect and change your workplace culture.